How Childhood Stress Can Knock 20 Years Off Your Life (www.theguardian.com)

I agree with your view of how things should be, but I have to deal with  the reality of what happens in Milwaukee.  Maybe your environment is different.  I hope you do not take my comments as being negative and not wanting to work together.  That is not the case.  I work very well with systems and providers who understand the issues of people of color who are also poor.  But too many see our community as the problem, rather than a community with problems.  

Thank you your comments.  It is helpful to hear from others on these important issues.

Hello friends,

  In the hope that WE work together and BECOME ONE WITH each other. I agree with Jane that it is no longer US vs THEM mentality. we must RISE UP IN COURAGE and not fall into the "mindtrap"  of other wounded minds that are still in "Combat mode". In this group and social platform we can develop "WIN-WIN Partnerships. We have a "common problem" ie we are all adult survivors of trauma in some form.

Rick

Jane Stevens posted:

With what we know about ACEs now, and the research that's been done in men's and women's prisons, most (80+ to 90+) incarcerated people do have a good number of the original 10 ACEs, and probably a greater percent have the original 10 plus the others added to subsequent ACE surveys (racism, bullying, witnessing violence outside the home, involvement with the foster care system, living in an unsafe neighborhood, etc.).

So, educating them about ACEs is a good first step so that they can understand that they weren't born bad, that they had no control over what happened to them as children and what happened wasn't their fault, that they coped appropriately given that they were provided no other and healthier options, and that they can change.

So, I would say that a different approach, the educational approach that Patricia is taking, instead of our traditional approaches of, for example, having people say how "bad" they are, which obviously don't work, help people develop a different understanding of themselves and their environment.

Jane, I don't know where you get your statistics but I'd avoid it/them from now on. There are NO scientifically reputable studies of sexual offenders  which give a figure as high as you're quoting. I've given a reference people can use to get a more reputable figure, from a very prominent and well-regarded clinician/researcher.

There are things called distal and proximal causes, and consider this real world example. A man in prison for repeated rape offences talks of how his introduction to sex was acting as "cockatoo" -- lookout for his sister when she, unbeknown to their parents, would have sex in various "boyfriends'" cars when they would come to visit her. She'd rope him in to stand on a street corner, warning her if anyone approached who might interrupt her activities -- that's the "distal cause" -- cause removed in time from the "behavior of interest" -- his rapes.  "Proximal causes" -- what's most important to address to prevent re-offending, are the attitudes, values and beliefs to do with sex, women, and relationships-- taught by his sister -- he used to justify his behaviour / rapes: "whatever they say, women want it as much as guys"; "they're only using guys to get what they want"; "they're just as mercenary as men are, so why shouldn't I be mercenary, and punishing, in my encounters (if they "break the rules")". These are the beliefs that need to be addressed, confronted, corrected, as part of his rehabilitation. Now, it's OK to be compassionate towards the guy for the way his sister "sexually abused" him -- exposing him to sexual behaviour at a time he wasn't mature enough to deal maturely with. I think there are many such situations which will not fit into any past, expanded present, or future list of ACEs.  But helping him deal with that musn't stand in the way of the consideration an effort he needs to put into the other 90% of the work he has to do. So, remember, I'm not discouraging educating offenders about so-called ACEs but it has to done in a way that doesn't derail the therapy program. Unfortunately, I just don't think the research is there supporting the broader conception of ACEs. Traditionally, the question has been "How many offenders were sexually / physically abused themselves?" Sexual and violent offenders themselves do tend to have been more often the victims of sexual and violent offenders-- neglecting that sexual offences really aren't motivated by need for sex, but about power and control -- but no figures put it as high as 90%.

Programs which I've run, or been involved with, for over 15 years, in five different countries (Australia, England, Scotland, USA, Canada), haven't been about reminding the men that they are bad -- but it's the behaviour that's been "dysfunctional" -- not the best way in which to have their needs met. The job then involves helping them find better ways.

Just in case people had difficulty finding the video I was mentioning, 

have a look here

With what we know about ACEs now, and the research that's been done in men's and women's prisons, most (80+ to 90+) incarcerated people do have a good number of the original 10 ACEs, and probably a greater percent have the original 10 plus the others added to subsequent ACE surveys (racism, bullying, witnessing violence outside the home, involvement with the foster care system, living in an unsafe neighborhood, etc.).

So, educating them about ACEs is a good first step so that they can understand that they weren't born bad, that they had no control over what happened to them as children and what happened wasn't their fault, that they coped appropriately given that they were provided no other and healthier options, and that they can change.

So, I would say that a different approach, the educational approach that Patricia is taking, instead of our traditional approaches of, for example, having people say how "bad" they are, which obviously don't work, help people develop a different understanding of themselves and their environment.

Patricia McManus posted:

Thank You

In Milwaukee, there is a great deal of activity in training all the systems and providers on trauma informed care.  There has been no real effort to educate the community about trauma and its impact on children and their families.  This is an approach of doing to rather than with.  

With minimal funding, our agency started in 2015 to educate the community.  We started in the end of 2016 to go to the Milwaukee County House of Corrections to provide these educational sessions to men and women who are incarcerated.  The response has amazing.  We have had to expand the one 2 hr session to two 2 hour sessions. While we present information, the best part of the time is the dialogue and to see the obvious new insights they gain about themselves.  

Last Sunday, I was at a dance competition for one of my granddaughters and a young man came up to me and said" You came to the House of Corrections when I was locked up. I really thought about many of the things that you said."

This is a first step, but an important step!!!

Please don't be offended or discouraged by my words but ...

I once managed a custodially-based (prison-based) sex offenders treatment program. On arriving I discovered that the men were really into victim-thinking -- ALL had stories of being "sexually abused" themselves, and were devoting all of their time on the program to addressing  their own "victimhood", and not addresssing the very uncomfortable working of addressing their own offence cycles, skill deficits, cognitive distortions etc etc -- those things that if not addressed would lead to their offending again.

But the problem is -- not all had been victims. 

What the senior staff decided was to help the men individually, in private sessions with therapists, address any history of being abused; and address the other issues in-group -- standard format for SOTPs -- to minmize the severity of what they had done etc. What needs to be avoided (if you know the "classics" -- Yochelson & Samenow) is "criminal sentimentality". 

One of our staff left the program to enter academia -- Stephen Smallbone, whose study attempting to find the "real" number of offenders who had been victimized as children -- it's always been very "muddy" -- has been discussed and can be found on Yahoo -- he's also at  Griffith University in Queensland.

So, I wish you well, but I wouldn't do it without the involvement of any therapists already working with the men.

Wow, Patricia. What you're doing is fabulous! I'll contact you to find out more.

Thank You

In Milwaukee, there is a great deal of activity in training all the systems and providers on trauma informed care.  There has been no real effort to educate the community about trauma and its impact on children and their families.  This is an approach of doing to rather than with.  

With minimal funding, our agency started in 2015 to educate the community.  We started in the end of 2016 to go to the Milwaukee County House of Corrections to provide these educational sessions to men and women who are incarcerated.  The response has amazing.  We have had to expand the one 2 hr session to two 2 hour sessions. While we present information, the best part of the time is the dialogue and to see the obvious new insights they gain about themselves.  

Last Sunday, I was at a dance competition for one of my granddaughters and a young man came up to me and said" You came to the House of Corrections when I was locked up. I really thought about many of the things that you said."

This is a first step, but an important step!!!

Yes, I understand, and that's why I sincerely hope that the ACEs movement can help people understand that we all have ACEs or are affected by ACEs, that our systems must change so that they prevent trauma and that they stop traumatizing already traumatized people. Education is the first step, especially understanding that ACEs are not a us-them thing, but that we're all in this together, and that we must heal together.

Thank you for all that you do to spread this knowledge, and if you have any ideas for increasing the speed and efficacy of educating people about this, please let me know.

Thank you Jane for your comment.  I hope you understand that I see on a daily basis the impact of historical trauma in my community and resources to assist continually go to people outside of the community who have no understanding of our daily trauma impact.  Many policies have been developed that treat people in my community as criminals as it related to their children and their families.  They do not even get chance to heal because it has become a state of continuing trauma with no stopping in sight.  

I am very happy for those who have the resources and support to address their issues once they become aware of them.  For those with less resources and support it is an ongoing trauma journey.  

Thanks for sharing your journey with us, Rick. I'm so glad you're on a healing road.

Patricia -- I think there are many more people who have not heard about ACEs science, including historical trauma, or understand its impact, than those who have. We still have a long, long way to go to a common understanding.

Why is this article so surprising?  Has no one heard of historical trauma.  Historical trauma has been shown to go back centuries not decades and damages entire communities.   

Good Morning friends,

   I appreciate the truth being spoken here and how there is HELP..HOPE and HEALING FOR ALL who WANT IT. It was sometime last year I had read a interesting article about  , It was that "Childhood trauma is a accurate predictor of Adult health". This startled me and my own personal healing journey over the past 23 years in various treatment programs and various 12 step groups in 2015 I was finally able to get to start doing my own personal trauma work. I am currently working with a EMDR certified therapist each week. Coming out of various addictions and the disease concept of addiction I wanted to heal and resolve those UNRESOLVED EMOTIONAL CONFLICTS I had in my biological family. its tuff because both of my biological parents were two untreated adult children themselves. for me to recognize my biological mothers mental health was indeed in question when I discovered that she was a "UNTREATD INCEST VICTIM and A REAGEAHOLOIC" I Never was able to connect and enjoy the closeness and real connection to the opposite sex. I always went for the egos magic of bypassing any true union of connecting Minds AND HEARTS first, then connect bodies later. thanks for all the brave and courageous men and women who are doing this work and having this platform to find healing.... and rest for my weary soul.

Rick Herranz Adult trauma survivor.